The Harvest Moon Consortium

[Bannor Bloodfist]

Our current project, the CTP_Tropical set, has a large number of features and groups, and a large number of terrains and crossers.

We would like to create a NEW itp that breaks the features and groups into sub sections of
Grass,
Jungle,
Sand,
Shallows,
Water.

And move each feature/group into the appropriate sub sections.

Anyone feel like helping?

[Winterhawk99]

I think I can do it this weekend bannor one day should do it I think

[Lightfoot8]

*grumble* I tried to made a longer post eariler, just to watch it vanish when I had to log back in.

Anyway, is there any place i can download a copy of the .set file for the tileset to take a look at it?

[Bannor Bloodfist]

I emailed you a copy of the .SET and .ITP files, no actual tile content though.

If you need a copy of the actual tiles, then we will have to wait.

[Lightfoot8]

Thanks for the Files, They have arrived.

I have a quick question about the use of StrRefs in the Itp file.
Is there really a point to useing them? Since (as Far as I know) the group name is never sent on-line. Would it not be simpler to just use the group name for the group/features?

The only reason I can see to use the StrRef's is multi-language support.
Are the tilesets being made multi_lingual?

[Bannor Bloodfist]

No real reason to use strrefs, in fact, a large number of groups/features don't have them anyway. It is not an issue on that one at all.

I have a quick question about the use of StrRefs in the Itp file.
Is there really a point to useing them? Since (as Far as I know) the group name is never sent on-line. Would it not be simpler to just use the group name for the group/features?

I am not sure I understand the question the way you phrased it. group name for the group/features? You will have to explain what you mean a bit more.


Not real worried about multi-language support at this phase of things. NWN doesn't have a large enough community to warrant it anyway.

[Lightfoot8]

Sorry I was not clear on that. It was all really only one question and you have already answered it.

By using the group name, I mean the:

[group*]
name = Tilename
tile0 = ##
....


Where the name for each tile in the Group/Feature catagory would be name from its [group*] and the resref would be the ResRef from the [TILE*] where * is the number for ## above from tile0. Where groups have more then one tile assoiated with them and features have only one tile in the [group*]

Of cource would need to remove some of the underscores from the Names.

[Bannor Bloodfist]

Sorry I was not clear on that. It was all really only one question and you have already answered it.

By using the group name, I mean the:

[group*]
name = Tilename
tile0 = ##
....


Where the name for each tile in the Group/Feature catagory would be name from its [group*] and the resref would be the ResRef from the [TILE*] where * is the number for ## above from tile0. Where groups have more then one tile assoiated with them and features have only one tile in the [group*]

Of cource would need to remove some of the underscores from the Names.

Then NO. Tilenames won't be changed to allow that sort of thing to happen. Tilenames follow a standard naming convention that allows for the tileset name to be referenced, the absolute mdl name is covered by the tile letter reference and it's variations.

IE:

tctl0, tctl1, tctl2, tctl3, tctl4, tctl5 and tctl6 are all used as prefixes in this set. The actual set name is tctl0 which is referenced as the tileset name in the .set file as CTP_Tropical.

the rest of the tilename references what that tile is.

so, tctl0_a01_01 is mdl a01 variation 01. _a02_02 is mdl a02 variation 02. Etc. They do have references to what those mdls are, ie, the a01 etc, a02 etc, are mdls that reference the specific terrain, a01 typically being flat, with same terrain all the way around it, a02 still being flat, but with variations somewhere along one of the 4 sides as to the other terrain types around it.

This is even more critical in crossers, where h01 is a corner, h02 is a full width straight, h03 is 3 corners, and h04 is 4 corners etc. Once you get above h05, things are not so closely monitored, but it would still not make much sense to a builder to see a tilename with the real tilename instead of a renamed group entry.

Anyway, you don't need strref's for renaming the group entries at all. You can just type in a new name to be displayed in the palette in the toolset. You can replace the STRREF with NAME as a CExoString, with whatever name you wish. The actual RESREF points to the name of the crosser, terrain or tile that the entry points to.

For example, we have a group called Airship docked 3x1 which is the NAME field in the itp, and the RESREF points to the first tile in the group as tctl0_airsh3_3 as the CRresref entry. So, underscores work fine, you are only limited by total name of the tile which can not be longer than 14 characters.

As to tile renaming, what I was originally referring to, is how someone gave many of the tiles in the original CTP_Tropical set names like tctl0_a32_23 etc... those high numbers don't match what the actual tile is, and those are the tiles that I am renaming.

[Lightfoot8]

Sorry for making yu write so much Bannor, I think we just said the same thing. I wrote the last post from work so made the mistake of saying ResRef where I should have said Model. My Memory Failed me.

the resref would be the ResRef from the [TILE*] where * is the number for ## above from tile0. Where groups have more then one tile assoiated with them and features have only one tile in the [group*]

That ResRef should have been model.

So an example from the .set file.

[GROUP3]
Name=AntHill
Rows=1
Columns=1
Tile0=302

Since there is only one tile in this group it will go into the Feature catagory with a name of "AntHill". the rest of the information gained from tile 302 (tile0)

[TILE302]
Model=tctl0_p05_01
WalkMesh=msb01
TopLeft=grass
TopLeftHeight=0
TopRight=grass
TopRightHeight=0
BottomLeft=grass
BottomLeftHeight=0
BottomRight=grass
BottomRightHeight=0
...

So our ResRef field is the model name tctl0_p05_01 and it will get placed into the Grass Subcatagory sin it is mainly(all) grass.

so wh have.

main
-Feature
-- Grass
---Name AntHill(CExoString)
---ResRef tctl0_p05_01(cResRef)

If the {group*} had more then one tile assiicated with it, It would be the same thing Except that it would go into a sub Catagory in the Group Catagory in the Palette.

Crossers and Terrian ar stright forward. The just need to be catagorized for what group the fall into. or Nutural.

That way the ratio of Crossers/Terrian 's in the Group can diectate what subcatagory the Tile/Tilegroup[group*] go into.

Of cource there is nothing in the palette system that will prevent an item in the palette being in more then one leaf node. So if you wanted say a certin Terrain/Group to be to two different SubCatagory's, that could be Done.

The way I am currently looking at writing the utility is a comand line tool that will take the Name of the Tileset as a single argument.

When ran it will open two File the Name.set and a new one Name.sub.


The Name.Sub file I an still tring to work out a format for. I am not really that far yet. But it will be something like the following(using the tctl0.set as an exsample]

[Sub Catagorys}
count = 5

[sub0]
Name =Grass
TerrCross0 = grass

[sub1]
Name =Jungle
TerrCross0 =jungle
TerrCross0= palm
TerrCross0 = ori_bamboo


[sub2]
Name =Sand
TerrCross0 = sand
TerrCross1 = dunes

[sub3]
Name =Shallows,
TerrCross0 = shallows
TerrCross1 = ori_ricepaddie


[sub4]
Name = Water.
TerrCross0 = water
TerrCross1 = palm
TerrCross2 = stream

it would look at all the terrains/crossers used in the tile group, For each terrains/crossers it would give a point to the subcatagory that has it. Then place the TileGroup in the subcatagory that has the most points.

So with the AntHill group above [sub0] grass would be given 4 points and all of the other subcatagories would have 0 points. Placing the Anthill into the Grass SubCatagory.

At least this it what I am current tring to do. I am currently working on Defining the structure and procedures for bulding the Itp file.

So a lot of what I have visulized in my head my change. Like it has already many times.